Morning Lesson July 7, 2021, Transcription
Working in Ascents and Descents - Selected Excerpts from the Sources, #19
1. Rav’s Introduction: Of course, the work in ascents and descents does not end in our lesson, or with a few lessons that we study, or those few excerpts that we have to read. This work comes to us from above, it is the Creator who is doing it. He is shaking us. One time He is revealing in us a greater will to receive that is hidden inside, another time He starts to elevate us. Then we see, we check, we feel, and we research the will to receive through the upper light, the will to bestow. This way through ascents and descents, with a greater will to receive, and a greater will to bestow intermittently, is how we actually study ourselves and the whole of creation. We study our nature versus the Creator's nature, and how it is possible to get closer to one another and to compare. It is all specifically a result of the ascents and the descents. Therefore, we need to have a great preparation. What for? To be patient, to be persistent, so that thousands and thousands and thousands of ascents and descents will pass over us until the end of correction, Gmar Tikkun, where there is the greatest ascent and before that there is the greatest descent. The more we advance on our path towards the corrections, the descents become deeper and the ascents become higher. It is as it says that the “Lord has made one opposite the other” and so this is how we advance and study His work as “the advantage of light out of darkness”. It is always in such a way.
The greater the darkness, later on more light is revealed. And it's more and more and more in such a way that, like this (Rav starts drawing) like that. Each time our axis of time, which brings us to the end of correction, it will give us greater ascents and greater descents. We will always have a plus and a minus according to that. This is why all of our work is in accepting the descents in a way that we try to make ourselves smaller, and to feel ourselves as King David says, “You hid your face, I was alarmed”. Indeed, it is unpleasant. Each time it comes in different forms. We feel weakness, a lack of taste and we get disappointments in all kinds of different forms. In short, a lack of desire. All in all, different manners of lack of desire are revealed and accordingly the ascent comes and it scrutinizes for us a little bit the descent, it gives us more forces and justifies for us the descent we have just been through. This is why we have to learn one from the other. This is a study that doesn't end until Gmar Tikkun, until the end of correction, as it says, “the advantage of light out of darkness”, meaning the more darkness appears in us in all kinds of different manners, later on comes the light, the ascent. Then we study the light, the ascent, the Creator, the forms of nearing Him, specifically out of the forms of distancing and darkness that are in the descent. This is why, as it says about Rabbi Shimon who felt himself as “Shimon from the marketplace”, meaning just an ordinary person, a simple worker from the street. He felt that this descent was so significant that apparently following it he would have a truly great and special ascent. This is how we should also try to constantly hold ourselves through the ascents and descents. These two forms actually support one another and it is impossible to have one without the other.
Excerpt 19 (06:15) twice
2. R. (07:48) How should we try to be during the descent? Not to be passive, because it is very difficult to do something, but if after our effort we do actually perform something, then by this we discover that it was actually the Creator who brought us closer. It is not that we are coming closer to Him by our own forces but rather, He has brought us closer. Here begins this place of contact between the person and the Creator. Why? Because the fact that we are performing an action during the descent even though we are not capable of doing anything but just a little bit, that we are making some effort towards the Creator, by that we are actually performing an action. This is called an “awakening from below”, an awakening from us. This is the little bit of inclination that we have towards the Creator and even though we are not truly capable of doing something, this inclination, some kind of thought, some part of the action that we were able to depict to ourselves that we would have liked to do, is already considered an awakening from below. This is how we will discover more and more such actions from the side of the Creator, who is giving us an opportunity to perform actions on our side. This is why he says (Rav is reading) “every single thing that he can do, he must do it as though he is in a state of ascent. Therefore, when he overcomes even a little during the descent it is called an ‘awakening from below’. Every act that he does and he believes that it is the Creator’s will. By this itself, he is rewarded with greater nearing. Meaning that he believes that it comes from above, meaning that the person himself begins to feel that the Creator has brought him closer.” Again, meaning special relations between the person and the Creator so that if the person makes some effort on his part, he begins to see that it was actually the Creator who prepared it for him and He is doing it for him even though it is seemingly the person's work and he is doing it. But no, what is happening is that the Creator is doing it for him.
Excerpt 20 (11:17) twice
3. R. (13:14) This is why each and every descent is deeper than the previous descent.
Reader continues.
4. S. (14:01) From the previous excerpt that we read and also this one, it seems like the descents are more important or significant compared to the ascents. Is it so?
R. We feel the descents are more significant than the ascents, that is true. Otherwise, we would not be able to rise. We have to feel greater darkness, otherwise we won't appreciate the light. We won't appreciate coming closer to the Creator and we will not want to come out of them from the descents.
5. S. (14:49) What happens to the records that we have at each moment and which are not corrected yet?
R. If they're not revealed then they are still silent and dormant, they still remain inside of the person. Their time hasn't come yet to awaken through the reforming light. The Reshimot, records, awaken according to the order, from here until Gmar Tikkun in each and every one.
6. S. (15:42) When does a person get such a push that helps him?
R. A push in order to come out of the descent?
S. Yes, he doesn't want to advance and he gets a push?
R. One cannot advance. The fact is that he tries to nevertheless somehow advance. A person is in the same process as before. He comes to the lesson, to the workshops, to all kinds of events that the group is having, and throughout the day, he meets with them. In short, he does everything possible but mechanically. All of these things, he does them. Also, if he won't do it, the friends will ask him and they will pull him to it, this is clear. Besides that, he is not capable of doing anything. Inside, he is dead, dead. Even if he hears what they are saying, he has no response for whatever they are talking about, whatever they are studying. His ears are open but nothing really enters. This is the problem, the state of descent. Each and every time he feels that in a way that is clearer, and this is how it continues until he begins to see that his actions in order to get out of this situation do not help him. He tries to ask from the Creator, when he remembers the Creator, he turns to Him and sees that, that too does not help. Eventually the state of the descent, and also his actions in spite of the descent, nevertheless bring him to the state where the Creator gives him from above some awakening and the person begins to once again feel some taste in spirituality and connection. This is how he advances; we will see this in a few other excerpts.
7. S. (18:39) You mention that each and every descent is deeper than the previous one. Together with that you sometimes feel that you are falling into the same state externally, that's how it appears. It's frustrating. Why do we have the feeling that it is the same state?
R. We have this feeling that we are falling into the same states because in the states of darkness, in the descents, you can't quite distinguish between one darkness and another darkness. This is what it seems like but it is not the same thing. Nothing ever repeats in spirituality, ever.
8. S. (19:19) He writes that since the state in which he descended he can't agree to be with it. That's why he has to overcome each time and come out of the state of the descent and draw upon himself the exaltedness of the Creator that makes him draw greater forces from above so what is this action of drawing the exaltedness of the Creator?
R. The greatness of the Creator, of the greatness of bestow, all the greatness of connection, the greatness of the 10, all of those 10 all of those things pertaining to the greatness of the Creator or the exaltedness of the Creator, and the exaltedness of the act of bestowal, something that is above the will to receive. Because the will to receive has only one thing, it is without the spirit of life it doesn't want to move. However, if it sees that it has something that it can enjoy from then it moves according to the extent that it needs to in order to obtain what it desires. So, it turns out that a person during the descent does not want to move, so much so that he is willing to be like this as if he is just lying there in a single place like a stone. It doesn't matter what will be done with him whatever he might go through he doesn't want anything else. This is the natural descent and this is the form of the will to receive, the natural form. Now what we have to do is to build such systems around the person that they will nevertheless take him to some external actions so that he will take part in all kinds of events, let's say all kinds of actions and then in such a way he will advance. Whatever is in your hand and power to do, do it because all of this works against the natural will to receive because the natural will to receive, this is death that one is willing to simply lie down and to simply be there without any motion, any action and just to be open to receive pleasures and even the reception of the pleasures, he wants to receive pleasures but not to work in order to receive pleasure. We will check this more and more and see to what extent it is a special kind of laziness. There is nothing more than that.
S. So it turns out that the exaltedness of the Creator becomes fuel?
R. Yes, the exaltedness of the Creator if he hears about it if he awakens the exaltedness of the Creator, it gives him fuel, this is true.
9. S. (23:18) According to the drawing these waves are more or less similar but the sensation of the descents is much stronger compared to the ascent and also somehow sensations I cannot say that I am in a descent or ascent?
R. We cannot spell distinguish between quantity and quality in the descents, and well in the darkness, of course, we can distinguish more about it and talk more about it but we cannot get to distinguish once we come out of the darkness, yes, this is how it is in the beginning of the path you are right but wait and it will change.
10. S. (24:13) Excerpt number 20, do I need to ask the Creator for the ascents because they come to correct me?
R. No, we don't ask for descents, we only ask for a sense of the descent means distancing from the Creator so we cannot ask for that because it is the opposite from the purpose of creation. If you want those descents and ascent will come quickly, ascents and descents, then you need more and more to be drawn specifically to the ascents. We should never be drawn to the descents; we're not drawn to them because it is also against nature itself so you cannot be drawn to the descents. You're simply drawn to a state which is death. It is good only for the will to receive. According to our nature, we cannot distance from the Creator. We want to get closer to the Creator always according to our nature, either out of the will to receive which is the shell or out of the will to bestow which is holiness.
11. S. (25:47) Continuing the question from a friend, and ask you and continue to explain excerpt 20, where it says it turns out that through the Searot one gradually discovers the exalted this of the Creator until he finds the names of the Creator?
R. Who asked that?
S. Excerpt 20 at the end, it's says, it turns out that through this Searot that are the storms.
R. Which excerpt did we read, now?
S. 20, it says it follows that through the hairs one gradually discovers the exalted this of the Creator until one finds the names of the Creator.
R. Yes, so?
S. I wanted you to ask you to explain.
R. Searot also hairs are from the word stormy, more stormy he is accordingly he discovers the exaltedness of the Creator. This is what he wants to tell us here. Well, we learn about the hairs later on in the hair of the head, the hair of the beard, in Arik Anpin of Atzilut, but it's not relevant here.
12. S. (27:57) When as students of Kabbalah we can begin to feel ascent and decent and how can you feel if you are in an ascent or descent?
R. This is according to what we feel towards the group, closer to the friends wanting to be with them in one embrace or not. It is simple. First of all, this is the test. so, if we have an inclination towards connection towards coming closer this is an event and if it is the opposite, it is a descent. Because with respect of the Creator and with respect to other things, we may be mistaken and it's also possible to the extent that I want to be more in the studies in the scrutinies, but in short, the most important is with respect to the group.
13. S. (29:18) About the reading it says that only thanks to the exaltedness of the Creator and the forces from above, a person can come out of the descent and you also explained earlier that thanks to the wakening from above a person can rise from it so why do you need an awakening from below?
R. This is an order for us to see to what extent we are not capable of anything but hardly, hardly to ask of the Creator, maybe to ask of the Creator that he will help us but actually all of the actions come from above and to the extent that we prepare ourselves down below to be connected between us. Then by this we are giving the Creator an opportunity to bestow and to influence us.
S. About the drawing on the axis of time along the axis of time that you drew, the time of the descents in the time of the ascents, the lowest point takes a great deal of time. So how to convert or rather how to not lose the time in the ascents and descents and for it to be really like a pinch, a sting and the lines will become straight?
R. Good question, excellent question. By the person holding the group with two hands and is constantly in it and even though you were going through all kinds of different states you nevertheless are in it and you want to be connected to it truly like a baby who is grabbing the mother and truly attached to her body. Like that and then in such a way you can go through the ascents and descents in a rapid and smooth manner so that the Creator is doing it upon you but you are holding yourself together with everything and in such a way wherever he's taking you through, this kind of smeared or shared by the coarseness of the entire group.
14. S. (32:22) What is the difference between a descent that is expressed in doubts about the spiritual path and a descent that is expressed in lack of strength and lack of greatness of the Creator?
R. It depends on the doubts with respect to what?
S. Spiritual path in general.
R. There are differences, there also along the way about the path, doubts about the study or something else. I have no idea, doubts regarding several very different manners in that. I don't want to go into this now it is truly a topic for a few additional lessons.
S. So the correct investment in the group and dissemination should bring a certain kind of descent in one who doesn't get a different kind of descent?
R. Who doesn't hold on him to the 10, it will be very difficult for him to get out of the descents and also his ascents and descents become kind of smeared where they are prolonged because these are the states that precede the true spiritual states because he is not in the system where he is ready to actualize it and see it, and to precisely get these actions.
15. S. (34:15) You told us once about what happened to you with Rabash and you went to him and you had a descent, you were insulted by the teacher and you weren't able to get up. And when you get insulted by the teacher, is this considered normal to center a special correction?
R. This already comes from above. I can't really say and I wouldn't recommend to you to make such calculations as these things that I sometimes tell you about things that happened to me. to me with Rabash, don't take these as examples that have to happen to you on the path. No, this is not a good idea. Just relate to it as some additional story that there are such states but not that it has to happen to each and everyone.
16. S. (35:18) What is the ladder of values? How would you define it, the ladder, in which we ascend and descend?
R. The greatness of the Creator in our eyes and inside of that the greatness of the group in our eyes and that is all and inside of that it is me.
S. On the matter of the names of the Creator that we are supposed to attain, is there some added value or a result?
R. I don't know right now what the names is of the Creator I don't yet attain it I don't know what it is when we will start to attain those names with the letters meaning with the desires and fulfillment send the screens and all kinds of things and then we will talk about it but for the time being it is just words.
17. S. (36:26) What does it mean that we are dragging up our descents on top of the coarseness of the 10?
R. If I hold onto them then in the descents I feel my inspiration, my impression from the descent, my negative impression from the 10's in a lesser manner and in the ascents, I feel my impression because I belong to the 10 even more. We will learn that, how it happens that in the states of a descent we feel that to the extent that we are connected to the 10 we feel them less, a lesser influence of the descent over us but this does not hinder us, it does not take away from us the depth of the descent it just regarding the quality of it this is what we discover. In the ascent, it is the opposite. We will study this. It is not simple. We will go through the descents and ascents and we will become accustomed to it and we will do it in the group. We are not quite experienced in that yet and then we will see to what extent it is possible to work with it.
S. So how should I be connected correctly with the 10 so able to?
R. Don't be a wise guy just try to be adhered to and attached to them as much as possible without your brain. This way you can't do it. It's better to do it this way or that way. To the contrary, adhere to them in your heart and then out of the adhesion of the heart as it says the heart understands then you'll begin to understand what is happening. But do it through your heart, through your emotion, not through your brain the way you want to ask about it.
18. S. (38:42) Can you draw what it looks like to have ascents and descents through the 10?
R. What depiction? First of all, I don't want these drawings. I don't like these drawings. I used to draw a lot, thousands of drawings throughout my time, and I hope we have them all in the archive but I don't think that there is an expression for it here.
S. You made this drawing of the growing ascents and descents. I think it is clear but now you explain something that was a student expanded on that question of how the ascents and descents get stretched or smeared through the 10. Can you maybe draw and give it a depiction?
R. No, I don't have such a depiction, such a drawing in my heart or in my brain. I don't know but through the 10, I intensify the amplitude and the power of the ascents and I diminish the power of the descents but it comes together with both the quantity and the quality, meaning according to the power which is quantity times quality. I don't quite know; a person should depict it inside of his heart. To have such drawings down on paper then it remains on the paper. But it says that “you have to draw it, imprint it on the tablet of your heart”. So, this is what we have to do, we have to write on the heart.
Excerpt 21 (40:45 -) twice
19. R. (44 :50) I think it is clear, in general, it is clear
Excerpt 22 (45:01 - 47:46) twice
20. S. (47:59) You said it's obvious this is clear but it's not clear to me. Why is it so important if you're in a state of assent to go back and check what you had in the descent? Can you explain this?
R. It's not that I wish to go back to the state of descent but I wish to understand what is happening to me in order for it to help me in the future that's it.
S. How can you tell me in the future if every state is more progressive, it's new, it's different?
R. Yes but nevertheless, the quality of all of those states is the will to receive rules, and during the ascent, the will to bestow rules so I will see these things more clearly and I will know how to manage myself better.
S. How is the 10 related or connected to this process?
R. Is this, of course, if I'm in a 10, then to the extent where I am connected to it, I can save myself from the descent here. Yeah, and the prisoner can't break himself out of imprisonment since what is the descent? Whether or not I identified correctly but it doesn't is when I don't have connection with the friends and I am without help from them. That's why I experienced a descent and when I am in contact with them and I then through them I receive support and help then I am in a state of ascent. Whether ascents and descents, the degrees of connection between us in the system of Adam HaRishon. This is ultimately what is happening to us. So, the true ascents and descents can happen only in the condition that a person is inside a 10, and only he only measures it relative to the 10 otherwise it does not weigh his states correctly.
21. S. (50:38) About excerpt 21, it says there how to watch out from descents as much as possible, and now if I have to be guarded from the descents and number one, he must know how to keep himself from falling into a descent?
R. From descents or laziness. We can't save ourselves from the descents because we need to acquire, each time discernments and records from the shattering and process them and raise them to the Creator so He would correct them. But we need to do it as quickly as possible, meaning it all depends on how connected we are to one another in the10 and then our work will be very quick and easy. I would say joyful to such an extent that all the descendants will be felt as joyous as the ascents.
22. S. (52:07) What does it mean to keep himself from or to guard himself from excessive gratitude? Can you thank the Creator too much? Can this be harmful?
R. I don't quite understand the question, repeat it.
S. It says, here, that one has to guard himself from giving too much thanks to the Creator, when we come closer to Him, we usually hear that there cannot be excessive gratitude here it sounds like a contradiction?
R. Therefore, we must take note that to be grateful we must take note to be grateful to appreciate his gift so we can approach the Creator. Hence so when a person always looks during the descent at the state he was in while in the descent, meaning how he felt during the descent. Yes, so for us, it should always be equal, the state of descent and state of ascent, darkness and light. And we shouldn't be adhered to it, one and also in the other. Rather always be in the middle like in a seesaw. A seesaw is better. (Rav drawers again- refer to sketch). A seesaw here is a seesaw and we swing, here and they're ascents and descents, minus and plus and to do it in such a way that for us we want to be in the zero state since light and darkness come from one source. That's why out of light and darkness, we relate to them equally. Both night and day come from the Creator and we connect them as one, and we have no more appreciation for the darkness or the light and the other way around but that's later. For the time being, we need to yearn to be adhered to the Creator and through our connection to the light of the Creator.
Excerpt 23 (56:00 - 59:24) twice
23. S. (59:26) It's not clear what this trial is and what testifies that it was successful in that trial that I passed the test?
R. It's hard to explain. I think you'll understand it from the act itself. The Creator constantly gives us different states. These states are there so for us to come to know who we are and what we are. Learn the Creator's attitude towards us, His attitude and how much are we capable of dealing with what He gives us, how weak we are. How happy we are that we are weak and we can ask Him for help. How much we feel that we cannot ask Him for help. We do not need His help, we don't want His help, so on and so forth. Meaning all of the states that we go through teach us who we are. Therefore, each and every state that we go through, is like a test like a trial, an experiment. That indeed, this is how we work. (Rav reads) ' Every descent is a trial if a person can endure the trial meaning during the time of the descent what does it mean that the thought that comes to a person causes him to see if he is under the governance of Kedusha holiness or not. meaning during the descent a person can see that at the time of the ascent his whole structure was built on the will to receive for oneself. during the descent, a person cannot make any calculations. Have no thoughts no importance no calculation but afterwards when he receives nearing from above once more. which comes to a person by what is written 'I am the Lord dwells with them in the midst of their impurity' meaning that even though in the worst possible states the Creator's with us He accompanies us he invokes those states in us and he wishes to take us through all of those obstacles together with him and it all depends on us during just like during the exile in Egypt come unto Pharaoh go to Pharaoh invite the Creator to stand beside you and so on and so forth meaning it all depends on the extent to which he can see the Creator is with him and each and every state and though a person is still under the authority of self-love nevertheless an illumination comes to him from above called an awakening from above and at that time he must awaken by himself the state of descent that he had then he understands that after the ascent when he is in, although during the descent a person cannot make any calculations, rather later because during the descent he cannot feel exactly what he is doing. Rather later when a person receives some nearing from above and ascent of some sort, he is able to clearly scrutinize his state and that comes to a person through what is written, I am the Lord who dwells with him in the midst of impurity meaning he gets a certain ascent he must then scrutinize the descent that he went through.
I think what the reason was he received that descent and what he must correct so as not to come into a descent once more. This is only after going through both an ascent and descent that follows it and he looks for the height of the ascent and the depth of the descent then he can understand what is going on with him and it is not like it is giving him some form of insurance that he will not go into a descent and be weak again and make mistakes again rather it's only with respect to the descent he just went through but not in relation to any upcoming do sense because as we made this zigzagging lines in this drawings ascents, descents, (refers to sketch) the more we advance each descent is deeper than its preceding on and so we can't learn from the previous to descent about the coming descent it will not help you only to grow stronger in the group with the Creator and hold on the way a baby holds onto his mother with his hands and his feet he doesn't want to go let go of her, in the same way we must cleave on to the Creator and in this way we advance and that's why it will save us.
24. S. (01:06:15) There are such descents that a person gets angry with the Creator, and his life seems to decline to what extent should we analyze the states during these descents?
R. We don't need to really pick into those ascents because you can't really learn from the descent itself. You can't see anything in the dark and learn anything from the dark. You need to shine a light into the darkness and you need to try and be as close as possible to the 10 and from this closeness to the 10, you begin to see your descent and then from that state you can learn something but not when you are just in a descent, then you are lying in a grave. That only you must connect to the group as much as possible in order to observe the ascent descent from there.
25. S. (01:07:54) Many times we say that according to our effort between incorporating then we can accelerate the states that we are going through. Is there some kind of dependency like that and what is it as an addition with respect to the descents?
R. As much as we are at here to the group by that we how should I put it by that we raise the size the importance of the ascents and descents and only in the inclination in the connection between us can we increase the pace of it a create a sense and descents and hide the aptitude of the ascents and descents and in this way advance towards the goal.
26. S. (01:08:59) What kind of a descent can there be in which we are together with the friends in the lessons in the meetings of the 10 and how can we identify such descents?
R. I didn't get it?
S. You said in the beginning of the lesson that we can be in a descent even though we are together with the friends in the lessons so what kind of a descent is it when we are still together how can we detect a descent?
R. Physically, we are together, we perform various actions and I tried to be with them together. Maybe not in the heart but physically I can perform actions that would bring me closer to society. I prepare myself for the meeting and I scrutinize various things before our meeting so we would have a greater infrastructure for our connection but in my heart, I'm dead. But I truly hope that through these external actions, since we are in the world of actions, physical actions, through that we are able to make the upper light shine on us and we will begin to come closer spiritually to one another.
27. S. (01:10:54) I would like to be more precise. Maybe I didn't hear well: when Rabash writes to guard yourself from the descent so the descent will not repeat, does it mean to make the next descent take less time?
R. Yes, we need to come to a state where in each and every moment we can go through many ascents and descents inside each and every second.
28. S. (01:11:34) Regarding the descent and ascent in relation to the 10, my question is a person allowed to expose his inner state in a descent or in an ascent or by this maybe he can harm the 10?
R. Typically we do not talk about it openly. If you can see it in a person then you see it and if you can't, you can't, but these things belong to a person's inner state.
S. So he should not share it right. if he's in a descent he should act out as though he is?
R. Typically we don't do it unless we person had such a problem that he is incapable and can cause and bring certain harm even corporeally. l then he can speak and even then, not with everyone perhaps but maybe with those in the group who are in charge of those things are who are closer to him meaning you simply do not open it up, no. Otherwise we will confuse one another constantly and each time all the friends in the 10 will be talking about it, what do we get out of it? We need to constantly help one another rise above and for that I don't need to know the state of a friend. I simply need to bring high spirits to the whole 10.
S. What about the opposite state? Let's say, now I'm in a state of ascent and I love the friends, I feel that I love the friends, I love you, Rav. I want to hear you, Rav, I want to share with the friends how much I love everything. Should that also be to a certain extent?
R. To some extent, to a small extent, you can give it to the friends you can awaken them but to a small extent lightly don't pressure them.
29. S. (01:13:53) I have a decent and with it many discernments, many thoughts and then I have an ascent and many discernments and many thoughts, how do you do that many times in one second? How do you do that during the day?
R. Maimomides (Rambam) writes that our world is below time and the spiritual world is above time. The more we advance toward spirituality we will feel a second is something that can stretch from the beginning of the second to the end of the second a long time can pass and we can introduce many things into it. We can insert many impulses into one second. Before that we weren't able to do that, so spirituality is much greater than modern technology and there the frequency is infinite. Therefore, a second does not exist in spirituality, it is like infinity.
30. S. (01:15:36) During the descent the Reshimot records are awakened in a person but he cannot do anything with them during the descent a person typically participates mechanically because he doesn't have a heart or brain as they're not really working so he participates with the group as best as he can with what they do. Like a sick person among healthy people, later he wakes up and recuperates and begins to participate more.
Excerpt 24 (01:16:47 -) Twice
31. R. () I think this is clear to us.
Excerpt 25 (01:18:30) Twice
32. S. (01:21:58) According to the chart that you drew before it seems like it should be the other way around. It seems as though a person should learn from the descent, so the descent would be less strong.
R. The descents and ascents are stronger as the light itself from within the darkness as you can't have some less or more, it is the same except one is with the screen and one is without.
S. How do we synchronize correctly between the thoughts and emotion in ascents and descents?
S (Repeat’s question) What is the formula that connects the states, emotion and intellect and according to the ascents and descents on the axis of time from here to the end of correction. What is the formula?
R. I cannot speak about it. I'm not ready.
33. S. (01:23:28) Is it important to fill the gap between the ascent and descent to emphasize the ascent even more?
R. Yes, that is how it is as each descent is in order to bring us to an ascent.
S. Is this how we understand the previous excerpt?
R. Yes.
34. S. (01:24:03) I remember you gave us the advice to relate to the descent in a point and not to be over impressed by them, if a friend has a hard time being in a descent for a long time what can the 10 do to help?
R. Only to the extent of our connection of our common work in the mutual study and comment activities through that can we shorten the time of the descents and the ascents as we need changes, a great many changes to be impressed by everything on the path. The problem is that we are not going through the path on the ascents of the descents rather it is the difference between them. Is it in the difference between them that our movement happens in the change from the ascent to descent not that we progress in this way but rather ascent, descent, ascent descent. We think it spreads out along the axis of time but this is how it is in our corrupted feeling. We don't distinguish plus from minus and this is why we increase the wavelength along the axis of time but it is not so. It is constantly located between the ascents and descents, there is no time.
35. S. (01:26:38) Are we talking about the same thing when we talked about an awakening from below?
R. An awakening from below is a prayer the raising of the light of Hassadim (mercy) is something we receive from above. It is as if one belongs to the other but it is not the same, associated but not.